it's much better 2 live as if there is a Heaven and a God because there is. It is real! Jesus the son of God died 4 our sins and is in Heaven with God and his angels. And He will return. So it is better 2 accept Jesus Christ in your life. It's the BEST thing u can ever do.

It is more intelligent to live your life NOW totally and as joyfully as possible. It is more sensible to live life in such a way that it is a heaven for you. The future does not exist and nobody can live in the future or for the future. You can only live this moment.
If you can live this life as in heaven then will it really matter to you if there is a heaven or not? If it is possible to experience heaven right here then why even bother about some kind of a future heaven?

"Once you accept all your responsibilities in its totality,
you become mature.
You stop throwing tantrums and
you stop seeking messiahs.
Then there is no need for any Jesus to save you.
Nor can any Jesus save you -
he was exploiting your situation." --- Osho

Well I don't believe in heaven (and that's the Nth time I say it, I guess ) and I do agree with ONE about spending our efforts to make our present our own heaven on earth. For what about discovering heaven doesn't exist in the end? A whole life spoiled in a vain wait...

\"There is no way to happiness...Happiness is the Way...\"(Buddha)

"The most potent weapon in the hands of the oppressor is the mind of the oppressed."

You know, I believe in God...
but all this heaven and hell stuff...well, no...not really...
not as some people imagine with the big rewards and the big bad punishments.
I imagine nothing like that.
And I don't really worry about it...
what will happen after I die, I mean.

I just try to live a certain way...or do certain things... because it gives me satisfaction here and now.
It makes me happy now.
To do it for any other reason would defeat the whole purpose anyway...as far as I can tell.
I can't imagine living a certain way just out of fear or the feeling that you had no other choice.
It just doesn't make any sense for me.
But all that just doesn't figure in....
not for me anyway.
All I really think about when I think about my death...is that it be a quick one.
Not a long drawn out illness.

The best way to cheer yourself up...is to cheer somebody else up..
MT

We believers, have nothing to lose if heaven doesn't exist I am not thinking a lot about the afterlife though, I am more concerned about my present life.

Je grimperai sur l'espace lumineux,
Je traverserai l'esprit de la terre,
Je cheminerai dans la lumière
Et j'atteindrai l'étoile.

In theory it shouldn't matter as you try to live a good life because you want to be a good person.

It's better to live life for its own sake, without worrying whether there's a heaven or not.

It is said human beings are complex. I say it's a complex challenge to be a human.

It is better to live a just and loving life..If heaven awaits us...so much more...if not my family will have cherished my life and learnt from my example. There is no loss.

The un-inspirational behavior of others determines our willingness to believe their words. Their life and truths then become like wind, collecting dust in its passing. -lea

Its better to jus live your life knowing u done no bad things and hope there is some kinda heaven and that u will reach some kinda better place when yr life is done here on earth

Every blade of grass has its angel that bends over it and whispers, 'Grow, grow.'

I do not believe in hell as envisaged by other faiths,but i believe in the world to come,and i try to guide my life by what we call the fear of heaven..to me it comes down to death being the test time,how we rated on earth will determine how close to the eternal we will be after death.

How can I believe in God when just last week I got my tongue caught in the roller of an electric typewriter? --Woody Allen

So, everybody's heard of Pascal's triangle, right? Well the same man (a strong Christian, might I add) who created this, created what is known as "Pascal's Wager", and I couldn't have said it better myself:

"Either Christianity is true or it's false. If you bet that it's true, and you believe in God and submit to Him, then if it IS true, you've gained God, heaven, and everything else. If it's false, you've lost nothing, but you've had a good life marked by peace and the illusion that ultimately, everything makes sense. If you bet that Christianity is not true, and it's false, you've lost nothing. But if you bet that it's false, and it turns out to be true, you've lost everything and you get to spend eternity in hell."

Now, make note that our faith is not based on the hope of reward and entrance into Heaven, but rather the promise of spending eternity with God. No one really knows what Heaven will be like except for what is said about it in the Bible (which is not enough to make many claims of certainty), but we do know that the only way to get there is through a personal relationship with Jesus Christ

I try to live my life happily, honestly and peacefully, and I also try help those I can and to hurt as few people as possible and unintentionally. Just doing the best I can when I can.

THE CHRISTIAN LIFE WITHOUT PRAYER IS LIKE COMPUTER HARDWARE WITHOUT THE SOFTWARE!!!!!

it's best to just make your choice and be prepared to deal with the consequences either way.

~ PSYKO ~

Anyway, here we go again. For the wager to make any sense it has to rest on two fundamental assumptions. The first one is that reason can't even begin to contemplate the many aspects of the debate over whatever deity's existence, while the second one is that - as a consequence of the first assumption - god's existence or non-existence are, for all we know and can know, equally probable. Pascal also made the "minor" mistake of presuming that his god was the right one and that this god would favour faith over critical analysis of evidence, but given the first assumption's weakness, everything else becomes rather irrelevant.

How can I believe in God when just last week I got my tongue caught in the roller of an electric typewriter? --Woody Allen

Shaka, even if the arguments are the same, the whole purpose of this channel is to be able to speak your mind, without getting too hot under the collar. Also as a Newbie I really don't feel like going through 10 pages of dialogue. I like to keep up to the minute, You know what I mean Jelly Bean??

THE CHRISTIAN LIFE WITHOUT PRAYER IS LIKE COMPUTER HARDWARE WITHOUT THE SOFTWARE!!!!!

Follow Pascal or Pavlov the destination is the same.

"The most potent weapon in the hands of the oppressor is the mind of the oppressed."

Pascal's wager is a funny idea to look at, but it also has its weaknesses, as shaka has already pointed out to the discomfort of those who are uneager to see both sides.

I prefer to live my life as I am doing it now. Free from the ties of religion and doing my best to stay contemplative, to contribute my ideas. Living a life of free will and the therefore resulting responsability (see Sartre) also means, living a life fdevoid of the artificial rules that modern society tries to press upon us. Living a life freed from superficial expectations and the brainwashing of the grand media I insist on my right to follow reason and not illusions, to confront death and sickness and not to hide behind a glittering world full of pretty covers. Living life means to distrust everyone and only give trust and respect to those who have earned it. Living life means to enjoy what has been given to you and not let anybody or any institution spoil it. Living life means to be responsible for yourself and your acts. Many people tend to forget that. For example the pope who is responsible for thousands and thousands of deaths, just because he thinks condoms are worse than AIDS.

The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil. We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labour. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~ Albert Einstein

Unfortunately nothing you can pull over protects from being stupid, otherwise you would know that if people lived after the teachings of the Pope, there would be not one single person suffering from AIDS.

Wait... so the pope says no sex at all? I don't get it, must be because I am stupid.
What's your point? The church says "no sex for fun - only for reproduction". Fact is, AIDS is carried forward by any kind of sexual contact, be it for fun or not. So basically what you're saying is, that people in Africa should stop reproducing, because then they won't have any problems with AIDS?
Why don't you stop living, so you won't have any problems with thinking?

The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil. We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labour. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~ Albert Einstein

Truly a good question for yourself.

Before accusing the Pope of being responsible for thousands of dead people, one should at least know what he teaches.

Well, you didn't bother to correct me. How would the Africans be prevented from Aids? Tell me if you know.
Because your explanation must be a quite simple one, or not? If it is so simple, why don't you enlighten us all with how we can stop the spreading of Aids?

The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil. We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labour. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~ Albert Einstein

Unless you bother to inform yourself about those teachings you condemn and those people you condemn, I don't see any need to debate with you. I'm not your teacher. If you are bored and only want to insult, do it, but don't waste my time then.

So now that I'm actually asking you politely to tell us, you cannot explain how the great solution is and you deny to help us all spread the wisdom. Wow. That really makes sense. Since you seem not able to offer an explanation I guess you will just let the third world suffer until they're all dead. In your view they probably deserve it, because they didn't inform themselves. Love your neighbor, eh?

I ask once more, politely. Enlighten us. What is the great answer that could stop millions of deaths?
Or is there none?

The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil. We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labour. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~ Albert Einstein

As politely as you accused the Pope of being responsible for the death of thousands of people?

Well, you weren't able to prove me wrong yet, were you?
I am willing to take back my accusation if you present facts that say otherwise.
I'm still waiting for your explanation and I am quite curious about it.

The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil. We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labour. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~ Albert Einstein

Topic locked due to fighting.

Please remember that bans will be applied to members who engange in fighting and don't change their behavior after being warned via pm.

It is said human beings are complex. I say it's a complex challenge to be a human.